saintjay77

Im just trying to give my opinion based on what could have been said or though from either side. I think it would be fair enough for someone to ask questions of the police but doubt there is a proper way of doing it. Maybe someone can write to the local main copper in charge? Or maybe to the local MP? Fair questions deserve a fair answer IMO. Probably be like Pi**ing into the wind though.

Just based on that it doesnt sound right at all. I am guessing there are various reasons why it took so long to get to court, made up or real reasons, but the one thing that looks really bad is when you say there ban started. I always assumed that if you are nicked for something and spend time locked up before a trial, any sentance would start from the time you were 1st locked up. So in theory a ban from football should do the same IMO. Im no legal beagle though so would probably get loads wrong if I was in that position.

Surely that's the kind of people you would want to play poker against? If as you say they do take a more realistic line on the wages after january they may finally be able to start earning some respect from other clubs. The whole 2 fingers up at the world approach has managed to just about keep the press towing the poor old Pompey line but it won't be long before it turns to poor old Pompey will never learn! If it gets to that point then they will find even less people ready to help them out. Little way to go yet it seems.

To be fair, if they wanted to do that they wouldn't have bothered putting the bloody fence up. They thought, rightly or wrongly, that using a fence along with a high number of police, the public safety would not be compromised and the fans would also be dispersed quicker. They either left an opening on purpose so the few mongs that couldn't resist looking for a chance to get involved could leg it across the garage forcourt. Or they under estimated peoples inability to respect boundaries put in place. Still would be nice to hear from the police or someone on that side of the fence for their thoughts on if it was considered a success or not.

That's the thing though. Innocent until proven guilty should be the case but as soon as the press release as much detail as they did the accused rights have been taken away already. On a broader scale it's difficult to know if someone accused of football related violence should be banned from football matches until proven guilty or not. If proven innocent it makes it look like they are hard done by. But if not it makes sense. If you were accused of a violent act at work you would probably be suspended until an investigation proved your guilt or innocence so it's probably fair enough. Trial by press should be stopped no matter a persons guilt or innocence though.

Different formations work for different teams. Sturrock had his best seasons at Plym playing 4-4-2 at home and 4-5-1 away. The team seemed to like it and they got results. Our team seem to screw up defending far too often no matter who is in the back 4 or what formation we play. We have the players that should be ripping teams apart playing almost any formation. Actually getting them to hit the target or keep the ball or block the shots however is a completly different story.

If we had won the last game we would have been 3rd right now! Luckily for us the league is really tight still and there is room for error's. I'm still hoping that come the end of the season we will be in the top 2 but will probably be looking back and thinking we made it hard for ourselves. I expect us to bounce back and put the Posh away though.

TBH I agree with you. We are a long way off the violence in the 70's and 80's but there is still an element that follow football like no other sport. Should we just accept that and deal with it when it happens or take messures to try and get rid of it completly? The fence was a different idea that can be considered a success and a failure on different counts. It was decided before the match to have a fence and I guess all results considered it was decided to use it no matter what. So win lose or draw they were going to let everyone out at the same time and get rid. Had they spent the money on putting the fence up and organising the operation but still kept the away lot in they would have been criticized for blowing a shed load of money when budgets should be tight and so on. The worse bit of all is the media splashing names and address's all over the place. Which makes it all the worse when some of the accused come away from it with a clean slate! I think I could take being wrongly accused as long as the judicial system goes on to prove my inocense but being publicly trashed would be more damaging that actually being found guilty of anything. Innocent until proven guilty doesnt seem to exist anymore. Football fans will always be an easy target as long as there are idiots that act up thinking its acceptable cause its football. Any rational person would look at the sentances and think they are not deserved when they are compared to other crimes and punnishments but also any rational person would know that football related crime is treated differently due to the 70's and 80's. Doesnt make it right but until football can be followed like any other sport it will always be treated differently.

Couple of saints up against Pompey today in fish and gillet. Would be nice if they do well and dent pompey's push up the league.

The live update on the FL iPhone app is usually pretty good. Hasn't even started yet though so saints players has the chance to be a front runner for once! 3 points today would be luverly!!

Fair point but in this day and age I can't blame them for trying something different. Football related violence has been in decline for years but it's not going to be gone for good unless changes are made to make things better. I'm not sure if the police consider the fence being a success or not but on paper I would have thought they think it went fairly well. There was obviously a couple of problem area's that they might think longer about if there is a next time. We shall see though. I wonder how much difference in cost there is between the fence and policing compared to the policing to keep the away fans in? That must have something to do with the decision making?

It's been said already that keeping them in doesn't solve the problem. The numptys that want to hang about and give it the bigun from behind a line of police will do so even if the skates are kept in all day. Get them out asap and get the seats washed down before the stink sets in. Dunno if the police will use a fence again or not but reckon they will look to try anything that gets rid of crowds as quick as poss and they will prosecute anyone who steps out of line.

Exactly! It's pretty bad to fork out money on the cost of all the extra policing and fencing just to stop the few idiots getting themselves into trouble anyway. So the argument that keeps coming back on it all being the old bills fault is laughable. It might not have been the best solution and it might never get tried again. But keeping fans in isn't the best solution either so until football can ditch the violence that follows it I suppose the old bill will keep evolving how they deal with the supporters. I still think mixed crowds are the answer but not sure I would make the call if it were my decision?

The Police tried something different in order to get rid of the fans ASAP. There was no major incedents so in their view it was probably a success and they may still consider it an option for future derby's. With all the fuss over people shaking fences ending up in court I guess they will think there will be even less chance of a serious incedent if they were to do the same again. And why should football matches be controlled by what a few numptys might get up too? The majority of fans are people that want to watch the footy and get home safe. The minority can fook off.

I thought it was only 1 that were found not guilty so thanks for the info. Think its the right thing for the paper to do after being so public about them in the 1st hand. Not the same as not going public in the 1st place but better than nothing i guess.

So those lobbing coins or wing mirrors from the cars on the forcourt only did so into the crowd that didnt want to avoid it right? The ones that wanted to avoid trouble somehow made themselves into another crowd that made it obvious they were just wanting to get home? Wasnt there a report somewhere a while back going on about the type of people that got hit in the skate crowd? Prolly dramatised it a bit but I didnt see knobs like W******d being mentioned much. How you can justify acting like a pillock in a situation that was only made worse by the fans that didnt respect the boundries drawn up is beyond me.

Bet you wish you had a camera at the time like wot the police had. EDIT: Actually where did you see that happening? The saints side of the fence or while charging accross the garage forcourt? My old man came out of the stadium and happily walked the same way he has always walked back home along with shed loads of other saints fans all wanting to get home feeling pretty crap about the result. No bashing from the old bill, no horse man punching him anywhere and he didnt end up in the paper or in court for shaking of any fence either. Strange that init.

How you came to that I will never know but what ever. The Police reacted to the situation fairly well i thought. Had they gone charging in whacking people with sticks for shaking a fence then it would have quickly turned into a riot. Some idiots did a few things wrong and the police got it on camera. they followed it up with taking action in a way that it didnt cause a major riot where hundreds of innocent people could have got caught in the middle getting hurt. Or are you saying they should have done nothing about it at all? Its OK to lob coins into a crowd of people including women, kids and OAP's? Shaking a fence sounds pretty lame but what if everyone joined in and got through the fence? Shaking it had some intent to do something did it not? If not why shake it? Your in a hostile crowd and someone has a bright idea to get through the fence its supprising how many will follow. Look at how many legged it accross the garage forcourt. Prob only a handful of them actually wanted to get involved but loads followed suit to be close to the action. Next time people might think a bit more about the boundries in place and stick to them. And if they dont then they can expect the police to follow up with their jobs and give them a 5 o'clock knock!

1 got off by taking it to a Jury. The rest pleaded guilty so they obviously thought they did somit wrong. Just cause they are saints fans seems to make some people think they should be supported no matter what?? What if some guy in a saints shirt rapes your mum? OK cause he a Saints fan????? If you do something against the law in front of the Old Bill with Camera's then you have a good chance of getting nicked! Why is that so hard for some people to grasp? lol

Bit of a difference in that when in town on a night out there will not be many 10 year olds that manage to get caught up in any trouble. you go throwing coins or anything else into a crowd that includes women, children and OAP's then you only have to look in the mirror to see scum in any eyes.

Only one has been proved innocent though I think? The rest pleaded guilty so I guess they accepted that the charges against them fitted what they did? The other may have thought that they got the wrong person so stood his corner and won. Thats fair enough and IMO if he was close enough to any wrong doing for the Police to nab him, next time he is in a similar situation he may think its worth standing a few more steps away from any loons out for trouble. If he did nothing wrong and has been proved innocent then brilliant. It shows the legal system does work. If he was a bit more 50/50 and more involved than he should have been but got away with it then I hope he has learnt a lesson that doesnt get him into trouble in future. If he was guilty as sin and got away with it then he is as lucky as pompey but again I hope he has learnt a few lessons on what to do next time. Im guessing many more people have taken notice though and if there is another derby with a fence I would be suprised if anyone thinks shaking it or throwing things is as good an idea as it was last time.

I didn't really understand that post TBH lol

They put a bloody fence up to keep fans apart. Why bother keeping them in after when there is a fence there? Get them in, have the match and get rid of them asap. Why not punish a few mongs who don't respect the boundries put in place? If they don't have enough evidence to prove the accused guilty then the accused will walk free. I agree that the trial by press shouldn't have happened but if your going to try and make an example of someone it is no use doing it in secret so catch 22. The old bill should have made sure those named were nailed on Certs to be found guilty and been obviously guilty of something worth while. Could of done with nabbing a few skates throwing coins and so on too. None of that excuses the idiots that got them selves in this situation though.