saintjay77

I got that on too and was ready to slit my wrists for a sec. came on here and it sounds like we are doing OK from some of our lot.

We should have put a claus in for all our players out on loan. Any goals they score should count for us to go against our goal difference.

Username: Stanley Password: LoweOut ?

But to be fair there is nothing proving that by having a Britsh manager that knows english leagues success will be garenteed. Swansea have done very well with Roberto Martinez and we did utter hash with Harry Redcrap. I wonder how much Roberto knew about the lower leagues compared to how much Harry knows about the game? I think the system the club is trying to use has some legs about it but the staff still needs tweaking. Wotte maybe the answer but he may not. The English way has had many years of effort without much success so the Dutch way deserves more than half a season IMO.

from the way they behave in the press sometimes do you really think they behave any better? Lowe is known for his snipes, Wilde only speaks when he thinks someone will agree and Crouch has been sucked right into the t1t for tat exchanges with lowe. I imagine there are a team of espionage detectives in a side room listening in on all the comments and desyphering them as fast as possible so that there shareholder gets the true meanings as quick as possible. I dont think there has been 1 occasion where we have heard that any of the chairmen have actually laid all there cards on the table and asked the others if they could all find a way to move the club forward? If I was a major player I would get them all together and lock the door. No-one would leave untill we could all agree on a way forward. end of

I said earlier that our track record with good ole english/british managers is by no means any good so dont see why Leon is instisting on going that way. Fair point that JP didnt do the business but I liked what he was trying to achieve. I am happy for the same model to be tried with different personalities and see if it can be a success. will give wotte some time to find out if he is the business or not though.

just thought off another reason they may have said no, crouch owns about 10% right? Lowe about 6%? Wilde 14%? Not too bothered exactly but my point is this, if you own 1/4 of a business and the other owner owns 3/4 shouldnt extra funds given to the company be relitive to your shareholdinig? I mean if your 1/4 is worth 1 mill and you inject 2 mill shouldnt the other party put in 2 mill per 1/4 they own? If then the company becomes worth 2ice as much your 1/4 is then worth 2 mill and the 3/4 is worth 6 mill. If you put in 2 mill and so does the other party and the company still becomes worth 2ice as much all the benifit goes to the other party for very little effort and outlay. So on that bases Leons offer sounds as flipant and likly to go no-where as Rupes and wildes offer of crouch stumping up 6 mill for them to step aside. Christ I would love to sit in a room with them and listen to what they get up too. I bet its a constant working out of what everyone actually means with 1 stupid coment after another.

to be fair there could be plenty of reasons why they said no. obvious one that most people here will come up with are that they want control and would rather see the club fail than see crouch succeed. another could be that crouchs offer means the others also need to stump up 2 mil each. in todays climate can they afford to throw that money away? If you need to go to the bank for one of your other business' asking for money its not going to look that great when you have thrown away 2 mil without reducing costs where ever possible. sounds like crouchs idea involves spending money on an experienced manger which envolved paying off the exsisting team and paying more money re-shuffling the team. the good old english manager approach hasnt worked that well for us for a while so they probably think the change of direction they are trying to take will be more benificial in the long run. I have no crystal ball so cant tell you who is right but just because leon thinks he has a good idea it doesnt mean it actualy is one.

thing is if Lowe and Wilde have reduced the overdraft and eased the finacial mess as much as was agreed by Barcleys then everything is on target and the bank will look at the offer from crouch as a bonus if it happens and ignore it if it doesnt. if Lowe and Wilde are no-where near achiving what they set out to then they will probably force there hand a little and we could see crouch come back in.

all sound like nice ideas from crouch but the shareholdings are split so much that any one persons idea is quickly going to be slated by the others so turns into empty gestures very easily. I have no doubt Leon wants things to get better but just because he has proposed something and thinks his proposals are good it doesnt actually mean that they are. Same as Rupes and Wildes ideas seem good to them yet right now we are in the bottom 3. Any of you could offer to put in 5.5 Million to clear the overdraft if I stump up the other .5 mil. I would say no and look like I am not helping the club I supposedly support and you lot would look like the fan that is willing to put there money where there mouth is. At least it looks like Leon has taken notice of MLT and Franny's coments though and is thinking more about the club than the personallitys. I hope he still has this in mind when the other 2 buck there ideas up and think about the same.

kind of goes against the idea that he was pushed too then doesnt it? IMO I think he has taken the view of the fans on board and judging the reaction on here after the vote of confidence he probably thought he is going to get stoned to death should he step out on the touchline in front of the fans again so thought he would go home to get stoned in style.

yeah sorry im not trying to be 100% factual on any of the managers or trying to have a dig at them. I dont pin the blame on getting dragged into a relegation fight on pearson but the facts are he was it happend under his stewardship. When hoddle was here we looked better but nothing of any note really happened. had he seen out the season I believe we would have had a europe spot and things would probably look allot different now.

I understand that and couldnt agree more. I didnt personally want to see JP get the boot cause he seemed like he was a nice guy and was trying to do whats right. results tell there own story though so it was right for a change. Wotte however is a different person and deserves a chance doesnt he? The club have decided to change strategy's from the good old english manager that we have had for a long time with limited success to a new dutch type system with a focus on getting the most out of the whole squad from the acadamy upwards. How long did we perserver with the good old english approach? same system with different managers for years and only WGS got messured success. New dutch system has had less than 1 season so its still got some legs IMO. 1 manager couldnt get the best out of it so we are onto another. we are limited by the financial side of things but will work with what we have. If we went whole heartedly into this type of system with prem funds I think it could be very successful as the calibre of managers, coachs, players and youth we could attract would be far greater than we have now and the benifits would be allot bigger.

I am only saying thosse words because Lowe got to me and twisted my arm. I am sorry and it wont happen again

Madness init, Pearson is english and took us from mid table to a relegation fight, Burley Scottish but from the Britsh isle took us from a play off team to mid table going no-where. Redcrap English again and took us out of the Prem Hoddle - English and played about with us for a while before dumping us at the 1st better offer WGS - Scottish again but like GB in the Britsh isles, had great success with us but left anyway. Wigley, Gorman, Dodd, Gray, Sturrock and probably many more all had a pop and are from the British isles but none had any success. now we are struggling to stay in the CCC and in a worse position than ever yet we need a Britsh manager to come in and make things right? Wotte and JP may not be the answer but whats wrong with trying something different?

But in reality it is PR spin. You could offer to buy half the club as long as I buy the other half. I cant afford it so I would have to say no but you would look better because at least you offered to do something.

So its ok for rumour to be told as fact as long as its against Lowe and Wilde and its ok for quotes to be read as if they are written by the club and not from the mouths that speak them but its not ok to question it? Most of the "facts" that come out from various people are 9 times out of 10 twists and spin based on rumours leaked by people that stand to gain something. When it was 1st mentioned that Leon was ready to throw a load of money into the club if the others did there was uproar even though Leon knew his offer was designed to make Lowe and Wilde look like pillocks. When Lowe trys a similar tactic there is outrage again. When Rupes ditched Pearson we all went mad and said it was because he didnt choose Ppearson yet if at the end of the season Leon is back in charge many are asking him to ditch Wotte even if he is a success. We cant have 2 sets of rules so we can pick and choose which ones to follow when it suits us most.

Will we have a chance of winning there? If so will the fair weather fans come back when we are winning? Will Flybe do cheap return flights for original fans so they can still feel part of the club? These and many more are questions I want answering before the facts you have stated can happen. LOWE OUT DAMMIT!!!

Just a question but if Crouch offers to put 2mil in based on his % of shares shouldnt the deal be that Wilde and Lowe put in the equivilent compared to there ammount of shares? Therfor this offer should be open to anyone that holds shares and they should put in the equivilent compared to there shareholding. The shareholder fight always seems to be about the main 3 but there are several in the board room that hold shares and many others out of it. If they all agreed to put in 2% of the value of there shares would that not bring in some much needed dosh? I know some would have to pay more but if you own half of a company then the problem is half yours also. if you only own a 1/4 of a company then you only have a 1/4 of the problem.

I bet his arm hurts now after Rupes gave it a good ole twist!!!

This wouldnt happen though. The offer is for Crouch to clear the debt. Wilde and Lowe keep there shares but they just let Leon run the club. If he fails they will be back. If he looks like he will succeed they will snipe from the outside. Lets face it they all do that from the outside. Wilde and Lowe think they can turn the club round, if they had the supprt of all shareholders it may stand more chance of actually succeeding. Same as if Leon was in charge, if Wilde and Lowe supported him he would have a better chance. When ever someone is on the outside they will always be stiring and conspiring for those on the inside to fail.

True, I didnt think of it like that. But then if the rumours of admin are true why is Wotte allowed to bring in a striker and possibly more players to strengthen the team? (not saying he has but thats the impression he has been giving) To me its an empty offer from Lowe and Wilde and Leon has been guilty of the same sort of thing in the past. They are all pr1cks IMO.

stupid reason IMO. For Gavin to buy shares lowe will have to have sold his shares right? So lets say I buy Lowes & Wildes shares and then Gavin buys them off me. Lowe and Wilde still gets their money whether it comes direct from Gavin or via me. Gavin knows this but it fits in with adgendas of many to take the line that he wont do it with Lowe and Wilde there. Its simple realy, if he wants the club but doesnt want Lowe and Wilde there then buy there shares 1 way or another. If he doesnt want the club say so and dont fanny about with childish reasons.

Your basing that on Leon making a success out of the club. IMO any of the connected partys only have about a 25% chance of turning the club around. For the sake of argument lets say this deal goes through with Lowe and Wilde banned from comeing back in and therefor becoming silent shareholders. Leon has a mad idea to borrow money from somewhere to get us back to the prem so spends say 10 mil of borrowed money. We fail in getting promotion due to what ever reason and we cant afford to sustain the squad and its wages. We are basically back in th same position with a bigger debt and the only tight fisted shareholder that will take the flack for selling players is not allowed in the board room! Surly there has to be a way they can all work together? this constant offering power based on stupid conditions is really whats killing the club. Leon has done it before and now wilde and lowe. dont they realise it makes them all look like idiots?

well that doesnt fit in with the Extreme Anti's so it cant be true and must be just another scripted PR spin type stunt. Lowe Out!