Giordano

I agree that its all very unlikely but not entirely out of the question. Especially if Rogers gets fired and a new guy comes in wanting some of his own players up front. Especially if Rickie wants to get picked for England ever again (he wont be in the next squad if he only plays 10 by 12minute cameos as is most likely is my view) The comments along the lines of " why would he leave liverpool's bench to join southamptons bench" are an interesting point. Fact is that Liverpool never played with a Rickie type player last season and (probably) only recruited him as a Plan B impact alternative substitute ~ not as a starting player albeit his great record last year goalscoring and assists. They then bought another different type of player as a starter (in Balotelli) so when on the rare occasions Rickie does get on the Plan B is just to hoof it to him and see what happens. Apart from if its AL who plays him the proper type of ball like yesterday for his goal. At Southampton he would still be a sub - but if he replaced Pelle then the system stays exactly the same and we don't change the way we play for him at all. Our current system seems very effective and Rickie would be seamless in covering for injury suspension or simply just to give Pelle a rest not only because he just needs to play his natural game - but also because the majority of the team/squad already know how to play with Rickie. Put another way- Pelle has started every match when fit and apart from FF is the only guy we do not have an almost equally as good like for like replacement ready and waiting in the squad. Sure Shane Long, Mayuka and Sado Mane when hes not in the AC could do a turn as CF and Jrod if and when he gets back to match fitness ~ but none of them can do what Pelle does with his presence as focal point for attack -but Rickie could. We are one serious injury away from a bit of a problem that could derail us like Boruc's injury derailed us last year...And if Rickie was, God forbid, needed because of a serious injury to Pelle- well we know he would not let Saints down and we would not need change the style which has been so successful for us so far - or ask players to change there way of playing. Its not going to happen but a better experienced like for like does not exist. Kane is obviously regarded as next in that mould but Rickie would be better short term- for playing and squad morale reasons. Rickie will be dropped when Balotelli is fit. And return to playing 10-15 a week if he is lucky- or less. At Saints he would play at least that if not more.

Thank you Jimmy. Does anyone know what is the likeliest points gap compared to 3rd (or 2nd) bottom team to determine if this is a record breaking season yet for Saints in terms of earliest we have avoided relegation? Or if not when it could come? I know its all very exciting looking at the league table and I am a dreamer and have seen Saints win the CL and World Club Cup in my dreams like probably many others - I even remember being at the Dell being very upset after a 0-0 home draw to soon to be relegated Birmingham in our third last match that put the dampener on our chances of winning the league ~ and which now seems an eternity ago (1983-84~ 30 years actually). And yeah, i was at THAT semi final v Everton too....At that point I had no idea that would be the closest we ever came to winning a league and Cup double but who knows now.....but forget thast how many points before we are safe - must be 34-35 in this duff league and so i hope we have got that by xmas....he says with everything crossed :-) .

I think i worked this out once a long time ago in a different season... If i got this right in a 38 match season the maximum number of points IN TOTAL for ALL 20 teams is 1140 (38 matches for 20 teams and 3 points max in each game and that happens if every match ends in 3 points for one team and 0 points the other) whilst the minimum number of points that can occur at the end of the season would be if every game ended in a draw ~ so for all teams combined that is 38 matches for 20 teams * 1 point = 760. SO, Looking at the current table : In a remaining rest of EPL fixtures of ALL 3 point matches the AVERAGE gain for teams is c 1.5 points per match. IF 25 points Saints just stopped winning and started losing every match in that situation it would take 3rd bottom Leicester currently on 9 points (25-9/c.1.5)= c. 8.4 matches to overtake Southampton. In a remaining rest of the EPL fixtures of ALL 1 point matches BUT excepting Southampton lose all remaining matches it would take 3rd bottom Leicester currently on 9 points c. 14.5 matches to overtake Southampton (allowing for the premise that Saints need to get zero points so the games against saints for the other 19 teams are all 3 pointers not c 1.5 pointers). Somewhere in-between which is more realistic says about 11-12 matches safety margin. IF somebody knew the statistical average number of points gained per team in EPL history we could then see this more accurately. As an aside i do believe we are four to five wins away from avoiding relegation- which might statistically be the earliest that Saints have ever avoided relegation in our premiership or division one season history.

We need cover for Pelle and he is perfect. SRL may as well be on the bench at SMS but playing exactly the way he can when he gets on, and with players that know how to play with him, than sitting at Anfield watching and listening to a Manager and a crowd who obviously pejoratively compare him to Borini Suarez Sterling Sturridge or Balotelli ~ when he is none of those. Come back to SMS Rickie, play some matches be part of the squad and club that respects you and understands you. And who knows. IF Pelle gets an injury who is to say that our forward line up end of season might not be Jrod and Rickie once more!

Jay Rod is interesting. It is difficult to see how he fits into Koemans formation with Pelle playing, apart from perhaps filling the wing role he was doing for England. Is he an out and out target man like Lambert was or Pelle is? I'm not sure. What I am sure of is he adds a lot, and Koeman will work out how best to use him. 1. Jrod's best form last season came when he had Rickie up front of him- NOT when he replaced Rickie. Running towards the centre from out wide, left or wide, was his trademark thing and for a while he was unplayable. Mane does that best for us in replacement at6 present. 2. Jrods best moments came when he ran past midfielders and attacked defenders with his direct pace ball control and strength, generally from between the half way line and the penalty area. He originally was a bit of a jigsaw player ( goes to pieces in the box) but finally managed to start putting away the chances and the opportunities that he quite often created for himself. Again - Mane does that best for us right now. 3. Jrod was also excellent at tracking back and marking from the front closing down defenders in the MOPO typical Southampton press style. Long does that best for us in that area. 4. IF jrod returns then he would probably displace either Mane or Long rather than any other attacking midfielder or centre forward. I doubt RK would waste too much time on seeing if Jrod "he could do a job at number 9" in place of Pelle because he is not that back to the goals kind of player. If we have a weakness it is exactly that - without Pelle (or Rickie) our style of pla lacks ultimate end focus. That is why the Austin and Kane rumours exist because they are quite adjacent like for likes.

These are my guaranteed to start every EPl match if fit 8 players, with my guaranteed to be on bench under normal circumstances 3. Yes.Fraser Forster. on the bench KD Yes.Clyne. Yes. Fonte. Yes.Toby. on the bench Gardos : cover for RB + CB Yes. Bertrand. on the bench Maya : cover for LB + CB. Yes Morgan 1Big Vic One from Bigvic/Cork/SDF is on the bench* 2Cork 3.SD (only 2 from these 3 can play- the other is sub) Yes.Tadic Yes. Pelle That for me leaves 1 starting player remaining and 3/4 substitutes to be resolved. The presence of Sado Mane and Shane Long does give an immediate dilemma for the remaining starting place. Whoever starts then the other one is bench. MY first 11 in an EPL match at present would be : FF,Clyne, JF, Toby, RB, MS, Bigvic,SD, DT, SM, GP My seven benched might be : KD, Gardos, Maya, Cork, Long, Mayuka and JWP. When Jrod is fit he competes for a starting spot and will take up a bench space if he cannot dislodge Mane or Long- though i hope he can come back to what he was as at times he was unplayable last season for some defenders. Probably dislodging Mayuka. Come Capital Cup at Stoke I would start Gardos, Targett and the unused midfielder straight away but otherwise leave it at full strength for the starters, giving 1 or 2 of our kids a place on the bench. I think winning but being on the bench is as good if not better experience for young players as playing but losing the match.. *Its arguable that Davis, Cork and Wanyama are guaranteed starters if fit and are pretty much interchangeable but only two can usually play - not all three plus morgan and tadic as are they too "samey" ~ though its not a completely impossible a line up against certain opponents, certainly if we wanted to keep maximum ball possession for example to stifle someone. So, observation on the minute differences in fitness/preparation/attitude/form/confidence or the type of match is what RK uses to decide which 2 of of those start and which 1 is benched.

Good luck Jos. Top bloke. Thank you for what you gave our club. Always welcome at SMS and hope to see you next season here! So glad hes gone to a nice club and hope he gets a good run of games. I think he will do well there. Will look out for Norwich results now as a second team.

Very good. Thank you for that. Made me chuckle. Not sure what someone like Boruc would make of him, probably a tasty sandwich.

Cue my annual upset everybody and really badly insult and patronize much of our fan-base post......I totally agree with eurosaint. Today you can give instant praise and instant criticism, often directly to our players, team and to fellow fans without even having to be anywhere near to the criticized person. Back in the day this was not possible or as possible. Now that many / all of us have this gift many feel it is not only a right but it also means that what we/they say also has validity and credibility just by virtue of the fact that we/they have enunciated it. This is, as I'm sure you will understand, a right load of bollxcks. The ability to post on a Saintsweb thread is not restricted so we are always able to see evidence of the phenomenal ignorance of some Southampton supporters and their ability to voice crap from the safety of far far away. Most are not ignorant but some, the worst sort, are loud AND ignorant. Those who are quickest to judge are often the LEAST qualified by virtue of the lack of right knowledge skills and experience. Being able to steam up a mirror with your breath does not qualify your opinion. Without appropriate knowledge, opinion is just noise. Much of what is posted on this forum and you hear at matches is just that ~ noise, with little or no redeeming quality or value. Society is teaching us that everybody's opinions are valid (fair enough) but when the only redeeming feature of so many opinions is that the mouthpiece of it is demonstrating his right to be a moron then there comes a time when these people should be told to stfu. Those who are loudest and the fastest in their criticism are often the ones who should, frankly, take a deep breath and think it through because so often they are the last people anyone would trust to give an opinion on anything let alone SFC. It's not just a Saints thing but when you hear the morons saying the mindless things with people complicitly silent around them and with no sense of irony, no obvious self parody then it should ring an alarm bell that we, like all clubs, have our fair share of complete and utter idiots. These people are often blessed with a quicker path between brain and mouth because it is much less obstructed by the grey matter that does the thinking ; hence Pelle is Sh8t after a few games, Tadic cannot cross and so and so is hopeless (insert favored boo boy) The worst type of all are the ones who know they are ignorant and yet keep repeating the same cra8. Children might be listening and believe what you've said is true, just because you are an adult. I try not to have arguments with fellow supporters who slag our players off but i've opened my mouth in the past to remonstrate with the haters - the Guly hating period was a particular one - even in the championship he was getting slaughtered but if we are going to start with another round of this rubbish on Pelle in the EPl all it will do is show us up for a bunch of mindless supporters. Did i use the term "supporters"? Sorry. We don't do that nowadays. Nowadays we are clients to be entertained. I meant to say people who have paid a ticket for which they are now entitled to a football performance during which they are entitled to say anybody is cr7p at any time for any reason. Open season for idiots frankly.

Comparing JWP to Andros Townsend is not very fair. JWP is a fantastic player with still plenty upward potential ( i hope as england captain one day senior squad- he is my new favorite player now SRL is no more) but his job is totally different to AT. For Under 21's JWP played as DM/quarterback. His job was to circulate the ball, retain possession, be an option for defenders and attackers to pass to, track back and set piece delivery including that great goal he scored. For RK hes played more advanced but to be honest i don't think its his best position as he lacks that bit of pace and height and strength for all his other exfellent attributes most notably football intelligence, we are just lucky that in big Vic and MS we have super players. Against Liverpool RK essentially just picked his "best" eleven players and said - GO! Andros Townsends' job is to attack, get to bye line and cross, cause goal threat, shoot, and generally cause mayhem by running at players with the ball. Now it seems to be that the "Southampton way" for an AM is more about the former than the latter. But RK seems to want to have a bit more tactical flexibility than MOPO ever did. So having someone like Townsend - who might in some respects otherwise be considered as an entirely unsuitable player for our kind of football team - in the squad is just the additional surprise element X that might be useful to an astute and experienced manager like RK. He knows about the EPl. He will know who he can attack easy and who he needs to be careful about. A foreign winger wont know that if hes up against a man utd cb he just needs push it past and run fast for example... I think townsend would be a super buy.

Have to say I agree. All those that can quote stats go on and do so - but if he was not injured he would have been playing for England in the WC and when fit is a very good player able to "make the difference" for any team. You cannot name a single "winger" in the EPL or indeed anywhere, that does not have his detractors. Anyone whose job is to "take players on" will ALWAYS get dispossessed and be made to look a liability- will always mess up that cross, case in point Oxo last night - one moment he slaloms past three defenders and goalie makes great save that hits post , the next he lets guy run around him for besiktas to nearly score themselves. I think GR is probably too worried about his image to go too much one on one anymore but apart from Tadic and lloyd isgrove to a lesser extent who else is there in our squad can do that with speed and trickery? If our standard tactics don't work then he is ideal. Who knows. Maybe RK can do what Wenger did with Henry....or winger turned striker Ronaldo has done with his career. Hes still young enough and he must have something........

Merson has often been very positive about Saints and our style of play very often. I don't think you " get" him though. I think he is a great talent as a whatever he is on SS because he's certainly not a normal commentator. His soccer related comedy act on a Saturday afternoon is one of the best things on the telly. He has certainly taught MLT a few things. For instance MLT never said " it's a Desmond" before he met Merse, nor did he ever reflect that a forward had just hit the " beans on toast". I'm not sure, personally that these are great additions to our icon or his football lexicon but they mostly derive from the ever inventive Merson. Who probably pays a comedy writer to dream them up because it's not unscripted. He cannot be as out of it as he makes out to deliver this routine of his for which he has now become legendary - the mispronunciation of names, the cockney catch phrases, the in joke references to his and MLT laziness, coy whimsical references to past players predilections, funny food reference, his interest in a flair player doing a trick, his disinterest in boring teams playing boring.... They've become his trademark, He's helped create a soccer commentating style of his own in some respects. What he days will happen versus Liverpool is probably accurate. He's more condemnatory about Liverpool but it's his job to get some chatter going. Underneath it all he's Merse. Quite a funny guy if that doesn't sound too condescending.

I like him. He is a nasty bothersome player that defenders hate. Whilst he's roughing up the defence the likes of tadic Taider and isgrove might just get a bit more space to do what they do. I think that him, Pelle and JRod will be a good trio especially because both JRod and long have that extra big of mobility to work around Pelle who I reckon is a nailed on starter for EPL matches this season unless injured. For sure he's not a really big name player but The way I see it being unloaded by hull city after six months means he never settled. I can't see him not busting a gut to impress koeman with his will to win attitude. He won't be strolling around being a talented classy player that does not score. I hope he will be a dirty nasty aggressive player that WILL and does score dirty nasty scrappy goals. We got enough players who can try and score beautiful goals. GR springs to mind- this one is more of mongrel than a thoroughbred. And I think I like that in our team, he will become a fans favourite given the chance. Think Brett think Steve Moran, think the work rate of Adz, think scoring some goals, think a poor mans Tevez, think a forward of ours getting a few more cards because he is that much more aggressive. Give him that chance guys.

Not really. It would make perfect sense as the springboard to a really big team. One good season at Southampton and you can be bought by Liverpool or man utd quite easy you know.

Interesting read (s) Mr. Kraft. Thank your for writing them and putting the effort into doing so then sharing. It does bring to mind the tyrants plea "necessity" ....and as mentioned elsewhere it also, if true, directly implies that public statements regarding player transfers made by senior officers of the club have at best been disingenuous and at worst blatant lies. I'm not a wetback shocked at the notion that people say things that are not true -alls fair in love and war after all - and of course the public notification that we were selling players and doing so for the purposes you outline is hardly going to enable the best prices to be achieved but, but, something still does not sit right about it.... I think your analysis looks plausible and fits the events and chronology nice and tight - you were clear to point out this does NOT preclude a club sale down the line, indeed you allude that it leaves the club as a more attractive proposition for the deep pocketed next investor due to our ability to splurge on mega wages - which seems to have a big impact on on field success reading your other blogs ( who knew? :-)..) So, Chambers was the only weird decision but the sales the loans all kind of make sense. And survival this year means big buying ( maybe) but simultaneously big wages also for next season and beyond. Nice story. It might be churlish of me to agree the gist of what you say as being the truth but to then criticise the execution of this plan by the Board seeing as they've got a lot of ££ from doing it this way - for SFC benefit down the line - but given I am a paying customer of the business I still have that right. My best guess is there was no other way to do it " nicely" and the gamble is to win back fan sentiment, gullible fools we are for 3 points and a last minute winner at Anfield that we are - over a period of time. Ride out the PR storm and win the end game. Even including selling to a n other in 2025-16... Again, nice read, nice work. Saintly regards.

I already bought shares in SFC once and lost everything. I could not afford to buy saints when it was in admin and I could not now. What I am able to do though is see what's going on. And it stinks. I've supported Saints since I was a seven year old. Over four decades of loyalist support home and away. I don't care how much better a state we are in versus other clubs we can mention. I only care about my club and why I support MY club. And WHY support MY club is NOTHING to do with all this fake smoke and mirrors s& t we are being peddled. It's embarrassing. Humiliating. I'm proud of our truth as a club and our values. But they are being betrayed. We were never ever the best team but we honestly tried. And at least we had integrity. This season and this board are a sham. A confidence trick on every supporter paying to watch the team and every season ticket holder being conned because they pay to be entertained BUT the underlying premise is we are trying to do something. But we are not. That's over. The board are not truthfully interested in the team or the support. They are just a means to an end. Katherine's stooges. Good people individually that they might be but nevertheless complicit they are too. It's fake fake fake. A few results a few signings won't make a difference. Just hope next owners want us to win something and be here for the long term. One easy question- how many times you ever hear any of them talk about the future? They don't cos they can't and at least they can then say they did not lie. No dishonour on selling the club slowly like they are no rules to say you cannot do it that way. But do I have to be grateful they are doing it this way unlike the Villa way? Nah. I'm not grateful. I've contributed to one of her trust funds with my ticket money already. I paid. I'm not grateful. This season will stick in my craw as the fakest season of football I've ever seen.

I think that sums it up pretty much. I believe that in life you are either IN or you are OUT. If you don't know which one you are then you are OUT. KL and the Saints Board are totally OUT. Until she goes we will be going nowhere except downwards doing nothing treading water waiting til we get an ambitious owner. Even if Ronald proves a miracle worker it's meaningless because if anything it raises the price and rules out even more buyers. By ambitious by the way I mean sportingly ambitious not just ambitious to be even wealthier and get shot of this bothersome inheritance ~ as KL is. Long game it may be, but it's a game all the same. And SFC and it's support are the pieces and the pawns respectively.

My take on FFP is that it has crystallised the status quo to such an extent that football is quite literally a whole new ball game now. Most football Teams exist to make money by whatever means possible to them given there constraints on wage spending. Winning cups and titles was the traditional good way of doing that - but not the exclusively only way to do that now and indeed its now virtually impossible to do so apart from one-off cup wins. The FFP rules now suggest that all the small fry should find new income - the only realistically viable one is through youth player sales to the big clubs. Trying to get Saints to rival man utd in Asia is pointless because a lot of the attraction is in the history of winning cups and titles. Now that the future cups and titles are all sewn up by the FFP rules for the big boys that cannot happen. Ive read elsewhere about marketing Saints as the academy model around the world for developing young players. But there's a big flaw in that. The players all join big winning clubs - and thats when the kids on the streets of Asia start wearing the shirt with the name in the back - not a saints shirt. For me FFP means ebentually European or even world Super league is more likely. Allowing the national domestic leagues to revert to what they once were on a relatively level playing field probably with salary caps. I think that will eventually happen.

Totally agree with that - but its a matter of opinion what our % chances of not achieving that 3 years of TV money will be - much will depend on how much is reinvested in players plus Lady Luck. Overall we not loading the dice in our favor that's clear and the task gets harder every departure. It IS clear that we are more likely to get relegated than at the end of last season because of this risky monetising business activity. And that in turn will reduce the club valuation today anyway as it must be factored in as you say. How do I know? Ask the experts at Paddy Power, Spreadex etc.

Steve; my view on your querying why the player sales as they surely lower business momentum and hence potential overall club sale value is that i don't think many would have valued the players we have sold at the prices we got for them. KL has in effect probably converted £65m or less of on-paper assets into £100m of actual monetised cash/sold assets plus reduced the wage bill to assets / income ratio immensely. Great sale prices. It also ties in with playing more ( cheap wages) youth in the team. The overall effect is of a leaner club with all the financial (not playing) KPI's looking nice and healthy for the next buyer. That bit at least is obvious to me as I've been part of a business to which that happened in exact same way. Its not a rocket science thing. Selling key assets under duress makes for lower achieved prices. Selling them in this way makes for premium prices. The net effect- possibly us £35-50M more to KL - all the difference between successful investment and not frankly for her in that world.

I would be very interested to hear how Les or is it Ronald " sell" Southampton to, say, rojos or de Vrijj when its been just two in and what looks like 6/7 good players out from a team not in Europe and not likely to be next year either. Whats the motivation for good quality international players to join? It appears to be loads of money now and a transfer to Liverpool or man utd next season? It sure as hell looks like thats the only draw- there can't be a " project"..Established internationals don't go "ooh look at the lovely academy training young players to replace me i must join that team...

Given the rumour about interest in Van Dijk some might start to wonder that Celtic are for Saints what Saints are for Liverpool. The back four could easily be same as last year with Maya for Lovren as MLT suggests even today which is not a disaster OR it could be all change with Vlaar and/or De Vrij as well as Dijk joining the Dutch party going on at SMS. And if Morgan decides that is not good enough we might get Clasie as well. So when the Netherlands play international matches its essentially Saints v whoever ;-). Its starting to feel that this season we going to be singing "oranges" to the tune of "yellows" at some point...(or technically "sinaasappels" - which is dutch for oranges but god knows how you pronounce it!) indeed may I be the first to suggest it and thence take credit for inventing the latest best new terrace chant at SMS and for away matches. Koeman will hear it ans tuern to the crowd singing it and wave, of that ive no doubt. It does not get much better than that for a terrace chant now does it ;-) . Along with "its just like watching Hol-land" these two ideas are my gift to saints fandom. :-)

I don't think we got a fee for lending Osvaldo to Juventus. That is a surprise if I am correct but not much I think given the circumstances in which he left. Id hope we got say £1m out of it for what was essentially 3 months or so(?) but i doubt it. Juve probably just paid his wages and had an option to buy at the end which they've not picked up. As Juve did not want him at the option price then be aware that SFC would surely have ultimately said "so at what price will you have him?"....That he is not a Juve player today indicates that either (a) they do not want him full stop or (b) given the opportunity to maybe buy him cheap and then flog him on again at a profit they are still not interested or © they made a derisory offer that SFC would not countenance or (d) even the chance of another loan to them is not happening either due to either SFC, Juve or his intransigence. Given all that id say its 50-50 on a sale v another loan. A loan for instance might get us c £2-£3M for this season to put into the transfer kitty plus not having to pay his wages. Plus he will still have two years left (on his 4 year contract signed in Aug 2013) at the end so we could still sell him this time next year to whoever borrows him (and take his rental into account we could maybe break even on him by then even selling at a reduced price) ~ but on the more positive side his resale value might have soared if he scored lots of goals for Inter plays for Italy etc so we may benefit. Its better for us if he plays for a team in europe to improve his visibility - Inter are in europa league this year. As it is his resale value has reduced in the last year for sure - id say 50% down on what we paid given he missed the Italian WC squad and Juve dont fancy him at all in the prime market for his services- seria A. We could cut and run and get c. £5M back on what we paid or we could take a few Mil in rental and hope he is worth more in a year. I reckon the latter is more likely given that many clubs will be wary of his reputation, italian clubs are broke anyway and a loan is a low risk low outlay way of seeing if hes worth buying.

Well Dejan is the example i had in mind, Jrod another. DL Neither was home grown but both improved at Saints, I think the £5-£10nm price band is entry level for EPL myself unless they are truly homegrown, or a freebie or really old. Quite frankly saints can only blood a certain number at a time of our youngsters otherwise its a case of the blind leading the blind. Thats why we will probably see the need to get in some of these £5-£10m players in who (hopefully) already have got some experience - and who by virtue of the SFC factor might then increase in value. I think most saints fans would prefer a couple of £15-£20m superstars to add glamour and top quality a la Kevin Keegan but i don't think this board will go that line. Nicola might have done with Markus' backing but not KL.

Both the Serbian ex Pompey left back and the Aston villa Dutch centre back are rumoured to be in that price band. Both are also relatively old. I can get buying a 29 year old " guaranteed goals" striker in Pelle to replace Rickie and I think EPL CB experience plus of course a great World Cup makes up for being a bit old too for Vlaar - but the lb story seems like an odd one. I would be surprised if we did not get a better player at LB than what's touted around ATM. If we get to the Liverpool game With just Targett or more likely Clyne that , IMO, would be inadequate team management. Unless we start playing a back three -but seriously -not away to Liverpool?