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The point is; we were charged under one competition, then they’ve treated it as two. Which means we have received double the punishment. Although I actually agree with you, tbh. It’s all a load of nonsense. It’s been handled terribly. But you’re 100% right, the more we see what happened, the worse we look. We probably do deserve to be out of the competition now all this new stuff has come to light. I’m just hoping for a technicality that gets us to Wembley. Mostly because I think our “crime” is way less than most other teams do on a weekly basis.

If Boro ended up getting promoted then Gibbo has played an absolute fucking blinder, to be fair him

This is just delusional. Why on Earth would we be sending people to spy on Boro’s training sessions if not to gain an advantage on the pitch? Saying, "oh well, we didn’t really gain an advantage because they had loads of chances to score," would get laughed out of court. Boro could quite reasonably argue that they had a great tactical plan to win both legs but we’ve spent a spy up there to record all their formations, tactics, lineups etc. Out of interest, why do you think we sent someone to spy on them?

Instead of hiring shit spies, we should have hired spies who are mint. Mint Spies. That's a 1 hour self-ban from posting for me.

God and everyone else with half a brain knows.

Are you really that dopey. They caught us, that’s why we didn’t spy on them for the second leg, that’s why we didn’t watch the last 3 days of their preparation. It wasn’t a case of Tonda asking the bloke to pop up there and watch a few minutes of training, then come home. The judgment will be based on what effect cheating COULD have given us, not what it did give us. Anything else would be ridiculous, you’d be saying to Middlesbrough “well done for catching the bloke & bringing it to our attention, but because you did so, Southampton didn’t gain an advantage, so we’re not kicking them out”. FFS, people need to get a grip.

That has had enormous influence, even with "Saints fans" being emotionally swept up and self flagellating.

The fact they've got the exact outcome they asked for on their website stinks.

’Incredibly William Salt was alleged to have turned up to Playford Road ahead of Southamptons game with Ipswich, pretending to attend a family fun day adjacent to Playford dressed as Mr Blobby

it isnt a £200m fine, there was no guarantee we would win.

Don’t worry I have binoculars. Some kid in town was selling a box load on the cheap

Wait so let me get this straight, people are saying that the 4 points is for the additional spying and the expulsion is for the spying of Boro? That is mental. I hate that we did it and I have nothing but pure anger towards those that organised and executed it but that is not a crime worthy of the punishment. What is a bit petty of me is that I want us reinstated as much to play the game but more so to piss off 'Gibbo'

Hollywood twist ? Wrexham striker Josh Windass wants the playoffs rerun with them taking our place.

Yes but as long as Gibbo is happy everything is fine.

I'm looking forward to every single team sending all their analysts to Boro's training ground the day before their first home game if they get promoted to the PL. Maybe they'll invest in a fence before then?

Adrian Durham: "How can you let a team that has cheated the rules go to Wembley, that just can't happen". The irony of that statement following Man City winning the FA cup at Wembley...

God knows. It does not alter what actually happened though. People do things all the time that have no material effect on an outcome.

Basically, if you look at it that way, we have been charged with spying 3x times. Oxford, Ipswich and Boro. The Boro one in isolation has had the potential to impact Boro, fair. But the other two haven't impacted Boro. The punishment is essentially a £250m fine for us, and a potential £250m reward for Boro. Whilst anyone else implicated is ignored and Hull are dragged through the mire too. Make that make sense.

That being the case, how can we possibly accept that the timescales here can be legitimately described as 'following due process'? I get that they have the right to expedite their 14-day rule in extreme circumstances, but introducing new, additional charges (on a Sunday) ahead of a hearing 48 hours later is surely not legal?

Why did we do it then? For a laugh? This argument has to stop as well 🤣

We need to go on the offensive and go in with "all guns blazing" and make it very clear that if this expulsion is not reversed and Southampton immediately reinstated, we will sue the EFL for anything north of £55m (£100m?) (£200m?). Yes, we admit we were in the wrong and we admitted those breaking of the rules, we don't deny that, but we argue the penalty issued is completely disproportionate to the "crime" committed. Judging from messages I have received from non-Saints supporting fans, who say this decision is completely WRONG, in a weird way, there has been a complete turnaround here and we are now being seen as "the victims". Lets see how much "bottle" the EFL have really got!!!!

You also need to stop blaming the lawyers. I don’t really understand your argument about different competitions either. One is a league format so a sporting sanction of points seems reasonable and one is a knock out competition where points are irrelevant so not sure why you’d expect the same punishment necessarily. A few days ago I said on here I thought it would be extreme to expel us but the more you read into it the more it feels logical.

why do it. The point is, we willfully, knowingly, and pre-designed our own downfall. If nothing is to be gained, why have we been (probably) at it since xmas?

Ah but you've failed to factor in the Gibbo effect.

Looks that way.... Same crime, little or no indignation from the footballing world... Crack on with next season as if nothing had happened.... Sliding doors and all that...